UH athletics: Here’s the cure
Sure, there’s panic when a school like UAB drops football. There’s panic when a tornado rips through Oklahoma. But, relax, it’s not happening in Hawaii. Different circumstances, different everything.
First, UAB, as it revealed in its announcement, was subsidizing the athletic department with $20 million annually. If an athletic department can’t make a go when two-thirds of the budget is covered, there are bigger issues. UH athletics doesn’t receive that type of support for its operating budget.
Most important, UH football makes money. It might not make enough to buy new lightbulbs for Rainbow Wahine Softball Stadium, but it makes money through the gate, TV and radio deals, sponsorships, and so forth. And while UAB had competition from a little school in Tuscaloosa, Manoa isn’t worried about Hilo or West Oahu draining money from the sports pot.
But image and perception are important, so Uncle Stevie offers these financial tips:
> UH students each pay $100 annually for what is essentially a sports fee. Raise the fee to $200 annually with this stipulation: For every sports event a student attends, $10 will be reimbursed up to 10 events. If every student maxes on the credit, the athletic department will receive exactly what it currently receives (and attendance will increase dramatically). But most won’t attend because of various reasons, including time, interest, so forth. So then UH makes money from the unredeemed extra income.
> UH should impose the sports fee on its community college students. We’ve seen the commercials about the UH system being inclusive and blah, blah, blah. This is one way to make CC students connect with the Manoa campus.
> The Warriors are scheduled to play road games against Wisconsin and Ohio State during a three-weekend period. It’s time for the AD to use his connections and tell the Buckeye folks: “Yikes, my bad. No can do.” 1) It’s a financial hardship. Go to the Midwest, come back to Mid Pacific, then go back to the Midwest. 2) It’s a competitive disadvantage as the Warriors will be underdogs in both games. 3) It’s not a recruiting benefit for either school. OSU is not going to pitch to recruits: “Sign with us because Hawaii is visiting.” Even UH supporters have a one-or-the-other feeling. For instance, the alumni group usually attends, at most, three road games each football season. I’m assuming that two of the slots are marked for Las Vegas and Reno. That leaves either Wisconsin or Ohio State as the third. Those two games are too far apart for one travel package. I’m sure Ohio State can get interested replacements for a seven-figure appearance fee.
> Here’s the drastic one. Put only 80 players on football scholarship. With a full scholarship valued at roughly $20,000, the five-player reduction comes to $100,000. The savings then cam be re-distributed to the 80 players at $1,250 per as cost-of-attendance payouts. Or give the seniors on scholarship $5,000 per as COA payouts. More walk-ons actually make more money for the school. If there are 30 walk-ons, bringing an 80-scholarship roster to 110 players, then that’s about $600,000 in school-related revenue (tuition, fees, meals, housing) from walk-ons that the school will receive. That figure, of course, will be reduced with local students who eat and live at home.
Ekahi–ST, I support most everything, except the last point. In this ultra competitive environment, if the institution and state chooses to go forward, they need to do it on a platform that allows for the greatest opportunity of success.
Limiting scholarships while certainly giving breathing room to the bottom-line, hamstrings the program in both its ability to compete with similar institutions, but moreover its long-term capacity. Its the reason why the NCAA, utilizes the reduction of scholarship as one its’ most effective punitive measures against rogue programs.
Could it be? JJ the next UNLV head coach?
Meanwhile Hawaii stuck with Chowball for another season. Chow will literally drive UH football to its grave.
#3
It’s already too late, the damage is already done.
Boola:
Last one would be an extreme scenario (and besides, these are suggestions that won’t be taken, anyway).
I don’t think UH was at 85 this year, anyway, because it’s limited by the 25-new-scholie cap each year. The thing is, the savings are never rolled back into the program. For instance, when the coach’s pay went from $1.1 million to $550,000, the $550,000 savings weren’t re-applied to the program. They just disappeared. That money would be helpful in subsidizing cost-of-attendance.
All great ideas Stephen. But! We shouldn’t have to do that if we had a real football coach and AD. Those ideas are simply a make up for not having a winning football program because of poor coaching. We shouldn’t have to do that. We wouldn’t be talking about this if Hawaii was in a bowl game this year. The key to Hawaii’s financial success is winning on the football field. Do something about that and we have “no problems”.
ST
I like your suggestion on the student fee, although I’m sure there will be large scale complaints from the student body, but I think the school should do it.
Considering it looks like Norm will be back next year and season ticket renewals and walk up sales will probably be at an all time low to start the season, what would you suggest the athletic department do in order to try to create any type of enthusiasm for next year within the fan base?
If they impose the fee on the community college students, they better be allowed to go to all the games for free like the Manoa students. I remember when Uncle Jimmy was AD, he allowed the CC students to purchase student tickets before the athletic fee was imposed. The student section was filled more. But then the athletic fee was imposed and shun all the CC students.
They should make the fee less than what the Manoa students pay or give the choice to the CC students if they want to pay the fee or not. I’m pretty sure the guy who is trying to start a new career or turn his life around while working full time could care less about going to a UH sports event. He would be pretty bummed if he needs to shell out an extra $100 just for some sports fee.
If that is even possible. I think it will be extremely tough and will take a very big turn around in order to start winning the fans back. I think there are many that have a very negative outlook on Norm from the past few years and I’m not sure if that will even change for some even if the team starts to win.
Agree with WarBow. Extreme cost cutting measures fail because it does nothing to remedy why revenues are falling.
This is a bad time to make a decision on football (or a good time depending on your bias) because the decision will be heavily swayed by UH’s current budget problems (which have been understated to date), the likelihood of tuition and other fee increases or more cuts to Academic budgets and programs, and by the record of the football program, falling attendance, and falling support for football. The recent decision to have upper campus absorb the $13 Million loss from athletics will also be a negative factor. Great idea on the student fees, but any increase in fees will be a nonstarter. The key is to hope the MWC does not try to compete with the P5 conferences in providing increased and expensive benefits for athletes– medical insurance is probably the most costly one, but even the stipends and fancy meals are too much.
Raising student fees is raising tuition. It’s gonna be a tough sell after the last tuition increase. A gradual raise of $25 per year for four years will be easier to swallow than $100 at one time. Immediately the UH administration needs to come clean and report to the legislature a true accounting of how taxpayer money is being spent. The claim of autonomy to hide what could be questionable expenditures has created a rift between the legislature and UH. Maybe then the Legislature will loosen the strings when it comes to UH appropriations.
How about the a $1 a night hotel room tax to fund Title IX. Or $.50 a day tax on car rental.
I don’t like the first two. The first one is like those infomercials where they say money back guarantee because they know most people won’t bother to try and get their money back. There are always ways to trim the budget (especially these gigantic State budgets). Just go to the Athletics office and see who is playing solitaire on their computer and fire them, replace them with an intern from the college.
The second one is even worse. You are going to punish the people that can only afford to go to a community college by making them pay for something they will likely never see. Unless UH is going to fund a charter service from Windward CC to Manoa or the stadium, then a lot of people from the Windward side won’t be going to most of the games. When I was going to Windward CC, there were a lot of older people that also worked a full time job and a lot of more “mature” students.
I’ve said it before, but if you want the students to attend games, then you need to get them involved in the whole sports program. Like getting the architect students to design a new stadium, the business students to think of new out-of-the-box ideas, have the civil engineers design a better layout to get in and out of Aloha Stadium, etc. Then actually do what they suggest and not just throw it in the trash. Announce it in Ka Leo, have a contest, who cares just get them involved.
P.S. Why do you need the flash video to be in the blogs? It just kills my computer so I have to kill the FlashPlayer plugin every time I go to one of these blogs.
ST..
Is UH getting paid to play at Wisconsin and Ohio St?
find bigger donors
13.
They’re getting a decent guarantee for those games, which is great but when the program is looking to get as many wins as possible to become bowl eligible and win fans back it already puts the team at two loss deficit (unless a miracle upset happens of course).
SAFE travels to Coach Wallace as he heads “home” to Las Vegas.
Decreasing revenue from ticket sales could be attributed to PPV, cost of tickets, atmosphere at the stadium and other competing interest.
Unless the state changes the way UH operates under the current business model, there’s no way UH can make up for all the lost revenue. The first thing that needs to be done is allow UH athletics to keep all the money it earns from the all the sporting events (parking, concessions, etc). Maybe then, UH would be in a better place financially. It won’t solve all the problems. But, it would be a start.
UH football makes money. But, they can’t keep the money they earn. That’s a nice set up for whatever group or entities that benefit from money generated by football or the athletic department.
After watching this season football games and reviewing it last night. I finally realized I been chugging the chow Juice too long and too often.
Sadly my coworker made me see it her way Coach Chow Coaching is the Pit’s and his Odor is Stinking up the Football Program.
UH should get out of one of the 2 Big Ten road games if they can. That’s a real hardship on the players, coaches, and fans. Talking about setting the coach to fail.
There is time to work on a home game instead of playing Ohio State or Wisconsin. UH should keep the game that whose contract was the first, whether Ohio State or Wisconsin. Of course, if we have a big hit to get out of the game, then I would say forget. At least UH gets about $2 million for the 2 body bag games. But, that’s real tough. 2 out of 3 weeks in the midwest is murder man.
UH needs to change the head coach. I’ve supported Norm Chow but he didn’t produce. We’ve won 9 games total over 3 years that’s unacceptable. McMackin went 6-7 his last season and he was gone. I just don’t know what UH is thinking. They need a new coach and they need to win games quick to try & keep the talented skilled players we got on the island interested in UH. And we need to drop the “Rainbow” as well. Thanks and go warriors
20.
I think what fans forget is that that while 6-7 looks great in comparison to the situation we are in now, the majority of fans were very upset with the results that Mack had produced in his last couple years. They saw it as mediocre and felt that a change was needed in order improve. Mack’s downfall was also his bowl record and losing those games against Utah State and UNLV. Now of course we’d kill for a 6-7 record or 7-6, but once we get there the expectations will change and then the fan base will expect more and if that is not achieved, the 6-7 and 7-6 or even 8-5 will begin to become mediocre in the eyes of the fans.
So in my eyes letting Mack go was the right move, but the hiring process after that is where they fumbled and made the mistake.
Does anyone know the true cost of the football program? I keep hearing football made $1M, does this profit factor in the cost of Title IX sports in order to have a football team? Just curious.
ST,
Interesting scenarios.
If implemented, look out!
It’s wet and dreary today.
So, what to do?
Hubby and I are leaving for the lunch buffet at Makino Chaya in Westridge.
$8.95 with coupon.
What a deal!
Stephen:
Some interesting ideas, but still see the same misconceptions by several posters.
1. Winning games is important, and will help reduce the deficit. But, it won’t solve it. Keep in mind that the department was still in the red in the preceding 10 – 12 year period, except for 2007. They were winning games then, but still coming up short financially.
So, getting a new coach may reduce the shortfall — but it won’t solve the problems. And, Upper Campus has no clue how to fix this.
2. This sea of red ink will be compounded by COA. It cannot be avoided without increasing the gap between the haves and the have nots in recruiting, which will show up in the game results.
3. Raising student fees is not raising tuition. Upper campus keeps the tuition as it controls all money it gets. Interesting Q that has never been answered is how much does Upper campus alot to the UHAD, aside from forgiving the $13 million paper debt. Student fees are the only “visible” amounts earmarked for the athletic program.
We can all complain about the coaches, and not winning. However, there is an even bigger game in play — do we keep an athletic program at UH?
UAB dropped football, but is apparently keeping the balance of its teams — as they are subsidizing them. Not at UH. UH does not do that, or the Leg. Even for Title IX non-revenue sports. Ironic as Title IX was co-authored by one of our own, but may eventually lead to demise of all collegiate athletics at UH.
Eliminating the non-revenue sports is not an option, as conference membership as a Div. I program mandates maintaining a certain number of sports, as I recall.
The only viable options for future coaching candidates will probably come from lower division head coaches with efficient offenses.
I don’t ever see UH being able to cough up $1 million+ for a top end FBS coordinator like McElwain or an established coach that’s available. All the better MWC teams are starting to routinely hit $1 million in HC salary or more. UH certainly won’t entertain the notion of having to buyout a FBS coach to come to UH. Going the FCS or D2 route, the price tag is much lower.
Maybe take a look at the FCS coaches to see if it’s feasible and if there’s any interest? Just looking at the NCAA database, Idaho St, Eastern Wa, Montana St, Cal Poly, and Sacramento St are all in the Top-12 for FCS Total offense this year. FCS has all the X’s and O’s of the FBS, but not the depth of size or talent. What UH is clearly lacking is the X’s and O’s on offense. Talent wise, I don’t think UH is as bad as people make it out to be.
2014 MWC Coach’s Base Salaries (source: USA Today):
CSU – Jim McElwain = $1,500,000 (extended 2013)
Fresno – Tim DeRuyter = $1,400,000 (extended 2014)
Boise St – Brian Harsin = $1,000,004 (1st Year as HC)
Air Force – Troy Calhoun = $866,250 (extended in 2009)
UNLV – Bobby Hauck = $850,000 (extended in 2014, but has resigned)
Wyoming – Craig Bohl = $832,000 (1st Year as HC)
SDSU – Rocky Long = $800,000 (extended in 2013)
New Mexico – Bob Davie = $772,690 (extended in 2013)
Utah St – Matt Wells = $575,000 (extended in 2014, now reportedly at $800k)
Nevada – Brian Polian = $575,000 (2nd year as HC)
UH – Norm Chow = $550,000 (3rd Year as HC)
SJSU – Ron Caragher = $525,000 (2nd Year as HC)
— Note that USA Today list may not be 100% accurate as I found that Matt Wells is making $800k+ now. This list does not include bonuses that pretty much all coaches have. After seeing some bonus the packages, many of these coaches could break the $1 million per year mark if they hit their benchmarks.
— The list points out that most of UH’s peers are definitely outspending UH in the coaches salary department. The disparity would be even greater if Gary Anderson, Mike McIntyre, Chris Peterson, and Doug Christensen were still at their respective teams under their previous salaries. Their successors are earning several hundred thousand less to start their new contracts
Cancel games with Ohio st and Wisconsin
Find beatable teams on UAB schedule
and play two of their opponents next yr.
The cure is to have a winning football program.
Simple solution. Cease all sports including football at UH and use the allocated money from the legislature towards education. That would also eliminate many paid positions at UH. It would also eliminate media positions.
30.
Glad you’re not in charge
Any talented players on the UAB football team? As I understand it, they would play immediately. Taking seniors will bring maturity and experience. We need help at almost every position including all kicking and returners.
29.
Even if the football team wins the same problems will always be there. Lack of financial support from the state, the financial deal situation with the stadium, etc.
Also lack of transparency and accountability at the University
the only cure is to build a winning program. what you need is good coaching, take that back….excellent coaching.
Boise St. took its system to the next level by excellent coaching, turning 1,2,3 star players into 5 start players. Player development through coaching is how you re-build a program.
Better coaching leads to player development, leading to better performance on the field, leading to fans in the stands, leading to more endorsements, more alumni backing, leading to money for the program to improve facilities, pay coaches, and pay players(in the future).
Really? Really Kekaula?
Cure? Win, legalize gambling, legalize marijuana, have a lottery, Executive and legislative branches earmark more funds to UH athletics, make a deal with the City and State and host more conventions and concerts in the SSC, and have weekend car washes.
Up down, up down, up down, Hump Day! Just do it!
your idea about the cc students is right on. Ive felt for years that UH should include the cc’s. The cc’s are under the UH umbrella, why not make them feel a part of UH sports, since they don’t have their own athletic programs. DUH, something so simple, but the dummies at UH don’t make it happen. Some common sense on things, could make a whole lot of sense. Make you wonder why you pay these people big salaries who can use common sense.
Lots of written ideas and opinions here. However, the general public has no control over sports at UH. Ultimately it is the UH administration that decides the fate of UH sports. Further, the general public is not privy to all information including but not limited to monetary figures concerning UH sports. Thus, the blogs are rhetoric and an exercise of the first amendment (freedom of speech).
It’s great to come on the blog and whistle in the dark. Historically even with a winning program UH Athletics was still in the red except for 2007. If that is the case than the problem runs deeper than just having a “great” football coach. We are a state run institution with heavy, heavy bureaucracy. It is easy to put the blame on the AD and the coaches but the business model needs to be changed. Well good luck in changing a model that has been there for decades. Let me ask this question…is the University President and Chancellor business majors and have the experience of running a business? I wouldn’t want them running my business.
MWC & UAB Athletic budgets from USAtoday
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/schools/finances/
RNK SCHOOL TOT REV TOT EXP TOT SUBSIDY % SUB
46 Nevada-Las Vegas $64,513,044 $63,672,024 $36,163,296 56.06
58 New Mexico $44,345,840 $45,046,275 $15,343,104 34.6
59 Boise State $43,166,257 $43,292,010 $11,496,954 26.63
62 San Diego State $39,211,827 $42,849,323 $17,579,724 44.83
63 Air Force $39,031,348 $39,497,086 $25,529,155 65.41
65 Hawaii $37,017,100 $40,357,387 $14,855,249 40.13
69 Colorado State $34,791,926 $34,468,927 $18,013,943 51.78
71 Fresno State $33,734,773 $33,050,314 $13,039,903 38.65
75 Wyoming $29,647,103 $29,731,941 $15,875,467 53.55
83 Alabama at Birmingham $28,159,249 $27,544,633 $18,070,530 64.17
93 Nevada $26,627,415 $27,274,229 $10,900,404 40.94
98 San Jose State $25,854,038 $24,440,274 $17,573,218 67.97
103 Utah State $23,684,266 $24,307,048 $13,690,026 57.8
The problem with SC’s idea of eliminating the sports program is typical of a short sighted person who is unable to come up with viable solutions except to eliminate and disengage from problems. We should continue to engage in a broader discussion of how sports helps in the identity of the University of Hawaii in all phases of her programs and how the current business model needs to change.
Unfortunately, taking the easy schedule route for more wins is no guarantee to better attendance. Look at the MBB team the past 2 years. It’s been some of the more entertaining UH teams in decades but because the visiting opponents are so weak (in terms of name recognition), attendance has been much lower than it should be.
For a 7-2 team, with some pretty good talent, great athletes and quickness, UH is only averaging 4700 tickets sold per home game this year. The biggest issue that has held back MBB attendance has been the weak schedule along with moving conferences has eliminated the last few rivalries UH had.
The perfect scenario for UH MBB is for someway to get include mens basketball into the MWC so they are a FB and BB member. The MWC is a very solid BB conference that would re-energize the fans for the conference season. UNLV, SDSU, New Mexico, Utah St all names that would draw fans to the SSC when they come to town. UNLV alone has more NBA prospects on their team that the entire Big West Conference.
However, this would require Ben Jay, Lassner and the BOR to pull this off. That’s something that I have no confidence in happening.
re: #41. Thank you for your opinion. I actually wrote that as a sarcastic blog. These issues are minor in comparison to larger issues in life such is God, health, family etc. So much time is wasted on these sports issues when other important issues should be addressed.
How is UH supposed to enforce the “$10 back for each of 10 games” idea? It will cost money to enforce it, so there goes that idea, draining money from the program already.
Another person(s) stated that if UH starts winning, then fans will start coming back. Maybe some fans, but not enough fans. Here’s the thing you old folks need to understand: football is not a big deal to the new generation of potential fans.
Last time UH had a decent team in 2010 (just 4 years ago), they won 10 games and only drew 36k fans per home game. That is nearly 30% empty seats in 50k Aloha Stadium. (Coincidentally, remember earlier in the year when UH threw out the idea for public debate about making a 35k seat stadium near campus?).
In 2010: Home opener vs #14 USC (44k), vs #19 Nevada (42k), and final game of year when the bandwagon fans start showing up and also when Hawaii recognizes their seniors vs UNLV (37.8k). Those were the 3 highest attended games, with the best teams possible, and they had 15% empty house. So, hopefully you fans who think winning will cure everything, will stop already. And it doesn’t matter who UH plays either, obviously with 2 ranked teams having >10% empty house.
Even the Pro Bowl has seen flagging attendance in Hawaii the last 3 years, they can’t even sell it out any more and need to paper the place (give away tickets) for TV.
It’s a sign: the old fans who supported UH football all these years, are dying off or unable to stand the traffic hassles to watch a football game. There are so many other options for entertainment, and UH has done nothing to grow new fans.
Kinda tired of these ideas to tax students some more, which don’t even have plans for enforcement. But it makes you old folks feel better, to keep throwing out old ideas haha.
SC’s idea is not novell.. THAT IS WHAT BJ has been preaching all year long…
have we all forget…he gets much press here n mainland.. n all negative for the school…
man eating apple…ur 100% correct…taxing students is noy answer..
and more importantly..” and UH has done nothing to grow new fans.”
thjat is the marketing dept…falls flat on their face…for every sport…bar none…
they can’t even fill the wahine baseball stadium n it is free.. n always very entertaining from what me read…ba humbug…
The big conferences have won the game. They have siphoned off the big bucks and created a lower tier of athletic programs of which we are a member. There is no easy fix for this. We have lost the competition in the boardroom and this will translate into decline on the playing field. It was not that long ago that Hawaii traveled to Alabama to play the Crimson Tide and we felt we had at least a chance to win. We lost but not by much and could have won. I cannot imagine any MWC team playing the Crimson Tide today and having any realistic chance of winning. The great majority of the MWC teams would be badly embarrassed in such a game. Maybe Nick Saban is a foootball genius. I think rather he is a competent coach who has all the resources he needs to compete.
There is no team from the big comferences that would have graduate assistants promoted to assistant coach the way they have been promoted to at UH. I don’t think this is because coach Chow can’t find anyone better. It is because we can’t afford it. I am not a coach Chow apologist and don’t think he has done a good job. In other programs he would be long gone. But I don’t know where we are going to get the amazing coach we all want for the money we are willing to pay.
Also college football has no mechanism to help the lower performing teams catch up (like the draft in the NFL where the worst teams pick first). So the big just get bigger with no corrective mechanism. To me this is a train heading in one direction. What is happening at UAB will happen at many other schools over the next years. I hope UH is not one them but we would be naive to think it could not happen.
Also, remember that the only reason UH Athletics was in the black in 2007 is because they went to the Sugar Bowl. If they went to any other “minor” bowl, they wouldn’t have been in the black.
Good afternoon everyone!
Unfortunately, we need a few million $ body bag games to help with the finances–especially now. As Former UH Athlete points out, scheduling weaker teams (who we pay to come here), is no guarantee of increasing ticket sales. Heck, that does not even guarantee a win, no matter who’s coaching.
The conundrum is that while we would like to play “brand name” teams to test our mettle and pull off an upset, the fans also expect a winning season and to go to a bowl game. No winning season and the fair weather fans don’t attend = lose money. At least body bag games are guaranteed BIG $$$.
In this scenario, I am not concerned about won-loss record for coach retention. Actually. besides the coach’s overall won-loss record, I wonder if anyone has compiled a record that does not count the games the oddsmakers gave us little chance to win–say, the opponents favored by 15+ points.
#30. Guess if they close up the athletic department, we will find out how much the Leg. intended to go to the UHAD, as the Leg. will likely reduce the amount going to UH for academics. Right?
Savings!!
#39. The answer to your question – “…is the University President and Chancellor business majors and have the experience of running a business?” is no. Lassner is an IT geek, and the Chancellor is a professor — assuming UH is a “business.”
As I said elsewhere, aside from what Oldtimer808 notes, the bigger problem is a total lack of responsible leadership at the U.
#44. Man eating apple — if you want to talk about taxing student by increasing the student fee, we taxpayers are being taxed too to subsidize the students. You really don’t think that the tuition resident students pay (as well as out of state students) covers the cost of higher eduction, do you?
Won’t be long before the BOR resume raising tution. Again.
Man eating apple:
And yet you come here daily.
This blog doesn’t have attendance problems.
#40. How do you decipher the numbers posted by USA Today?
If total revenue + subsidy is greater than total expenses, then you should be in the black. Have they included the subsidy amount as “revenue”? If they did that, then these universities have not generated that much “revenue,” right?
Seems odd.
Finally, a real look at the bigger picture. “Man eating..” makes a very valid point, winning is not the magic bullet. It helps but is not the cure all.
#47 I believe you are correct. I believe that at the start of his tenure he took less so he could pay his assistants more, to come. When you start from being behind your peers it creates a challenge.
When you look at UH’ s cost for transportation both for the team’s and the subsidies UH pays, I believe we pay quite a bit more than others. So chartering seems a bit out of the question given the budget balancing battle.
The issues are much bigger than simply firing the coach. I also agree that if there is not a big change to the existing business model, the UH athletic program would be in jeopardy. The mindset cannot be simply survive as survival would be only a momentary fix.
Actually, taxing students is a great solution because the students have no recourse. Pay the fee or you can’t register for classes.
As a parent who is paying UH tuition, am I happy about any increase? Of course not. I’m not sure why my kid is being billed for a bus pass he’s never going to use.
You can’t force donors to donate, but you can always tax students …
By the way, Mack wasn’t fired because of his record.
He was fired for issues internal and external. Even if UH had beaten BYU in the 2011 regular-season finale for a winning record, he still would have been fired. The marching orders were in place before that game. Losing that game made it more palatable publicly.
It was apparent Mack was out of the loop. He wasn’t notified until a couple hours before the news conference that UH would be joining the MWC.
Maybe UH needs to relocate the football team to the mainland during the fall semester. Team up with a small liberal arts school, pay rent for dorm, cafeteria and use of sports fields and locker rooms. Schedule all games to be away games except for senior night at home. Save on travel expenses. Screw Aloha Stadium. Make PPV and ESPN 1420 the only way to view or listen to games.
Nutmegger:
And don’ forget this newspaper. We’re at every practice and game, home or away.
Tele-commute?
Mr. Tsai, You have been my hero for a long time. I do not dwell on the negatives. I like your ideas. We have a total of 60,000 enrolled in various campuses. As you suggest CC should be included as someday they may matriculate to the next level.
I’d like to think or I hope so the marketing department is not taking any time off. Now is the time to iron while the iron is still hot.
Reading the blogs there are tons of supporters in the 60-80 year range that have supported Hawaii since Don King. I had to look that one up. Let’s get the people with the 30 year plus a discount of 30%. Early bird specials? Let’s give them a discount as well. Everybody likes a good deal. Family plan. Buy 2 tickets between the 20’s and get 2 free in the endzone to draw the families in. High school athletes should get a discount or even free tickets.
UH sports enhances the college experience. Give a little now pays big down the road. Winning is nice but judging from all the feedback UH football interest at least is alive and well. Somebody said SMU was 1/6 the size of UH. I don’t know where he gets his numbers. Their endowment is 1.5 B with a B. They said that if I was brown no sense apply. I looked at every player on their roster and there sure was a lot a players with good tans.
I am retired now but I have tons of experience in marketing. I’d sure like to volunteer but don’t know how. And one more thing. All those administrators and faculty all need to be included in your program. They should all go to the games and bring their friends, students and family. Ohana right?
15% empty house is a lot better than 55 or 60 % empty house. Deficit would be lower.
28
tennessee
georgia state
south alabama
troy
59
wow, that would be one long road trip
As I’ve always said, I’m not concerned about the budget or deficit.
As far as I know, the checks don’t bounce and the Sheriff Center still has electricity. There are many people paid a lot of money to figure out budgets. But until UH starts hocking equipment or using Group-On coupons for training tables, I don’t worry about UH’s problems.
Been saying it for years. Raise fees (addtl 100 = 2 million), raise ticket prices, but raise ppv most of all to encourage attendance. Big Time Football costs. If legislature helps, consider it gravy.
SC, you say we waste a lot of time on these sports issues instead of the more important issues and yet you waste your time on this blog? IMO, there are other more important issues but that does not mean we cannot spend time on trying to fix things that we consider enjoyment.
sad about salas…hope he heals well n soon..
also congrats to the 4 ‘hawaii’ boys who got selected to the pac-12 teams for 2014..
wonder how much difference it would have made under our ‘guru’ if they stayed home ???
Whatever happened to the future of University of Hawaii football or the athletic programs. I’m so proud to be a big support and fan of Hawaii’s sports. I been living in the state side for 22 years and in Vegas for the the last 15 years. I played my high school football years in Hawaii. I really really remember though day playing in Aloha Stadium and looking at 50,000 seating. But that not even the other high school stadium have it to. It’s really awesome and beautiful how it made for your kids to play there football games at!. But, I can really say this that? I’m really seriously proud to be born and raised in Hawaii!. All you Hawaii people just go to Vegas to gamble. But not even seen the high school football stadium on campus or what they call Sam Boyd Stadium. The high school football stadium here in Vegas should be really nice but not true at all. It really looks like a city park and even they baseball field too. And Sam Boyd Stadium it really can pass for a high school stadium. Tell me this if the University of Hawaii football game play in Vegas in the afternoon. In the temperature of 114° would you sat down on a hard concrete seating and also iron seat! Would you sat down on it to watch a football game? My father really love to go to Aloha Stadium to watch the UH play!. But not here in Sam Boyd Stadium not even when Hawaii play here!. I taken him once to see the game and didn’t really enjoy it at all!. So I’m trying to say that?. Be really proud whatever your state and city give to you! Like the Aloha Stadium and new high school stadium too!. Because over here they are always talking about a new football stadium but not doing nothing about it over 13 years already! And we still have a division 2 or 3 stadium not a division 1 stadium!. If it should shut down another football program it should be UNLV not the University of Hawaii football program. Because they have everything they’re need for there sports events. My last words for the program! GO RAINBOW!. and show the world that you’ll never give up or never be scared of other big University also your life to the world out there too!.
if we look at the first team all MWC…we can see the level of talent that we had…but i will strongly disagree..that it was not good…me thinks..the coaches..can n do bring out the best in players…that seemed to be lacking…. the past 3 years….
Interesting discussion and ideas by all.
I have two words to possibly deal with all of this – STATE LOTTERY.
Here’s a guy who might be interested in the UH job, and he’s only making $67,000 a year:
http://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/2013/john-l-smith-takes-his-smiles-to-fort-lewis-college/
ST- Sorry to hear that about Mack, as he was a good coach and was very “fan friendly”…If anything, if Mack wasn’t terminated on his football record, then they should have retained the staff and promoted from within. Hiring a new coach like Chow and the subsequent upheaval, left the program in a quandry…
WINNING CURES ALL…I strongly believe if you have a winning team and plays an exciting brand of football, then the fans will come and the money will flow. With no proven improvement and no promise of it for next football season, I foresee further erosion of the fan base.
WE NEED A CHANGE…Get new leaders or a new football coach or both…I hate seeing our football program going backwards.
For the “powers that be”, GET IT DONE QUICKLY and get this program “fixed” so people can “feel good” for a change about UH athletics…The only thing keeping my spirits up is the Men & Women’s BB teams. Benji is doing a good job despite the adversity.
How about win some games, football guys. That might help balance the budget.
And really, that’s the only way to survive. Hawaii plays in a conference that is a minor participant in the College Football Playoff and the ancillary bowl games that are part of that rotation. Only one school each year from outside the power five conferences will participate.
The upside for football is not that great. A big bowl-game payoff is not likely. It happened once. It might or might not happen again. The odds are against it, given the Mountain West is competing against the MAC, Conference USA and American Athletic for one berth.
The only surefire way to increase revenue is to win games and create interest in the team whereby people buy tickets and pay-per-view packages and corporate sponsors see a return for their investment. UH has to make several cash registers ring or it’s going to fall further behind.
Is the current football coach the answer? So far it looks like no. But the athletic department has to decide sooner or later does if he is. If he’s not, they need to find someone who can generate the kind of success and interest that have been in short supply lately. One would hope they have learned their lesson from a) taking the first coach who came along when they were panicked — McMackin, or b) hiring a local guy who wants to come home — Chow.
They need someone who wants to to do the job right, whether or not he knows his way to Rainbow Drive-In. Hopefully someone who would rather recruit players and game plan than gamble and carry on in Las Vegas.
Re: #66
I agree with you but we as the general public cannot fix sports related problems or issues at UH. However, the general public can send a message to UH by not supporting the programs.
I just wonder how many on here are graduates of UH. I wonder how many football season ticket holders are graduates of UH. is the alumni association targeting their own to buy sports season tickets?
I graduated from a college in the mainland and had season tickets from 1989 to 2013 but gave them up because I did not enjoy watching UH football under coach Chow.
Reply to uncle stevie’s “financial tips”
1. Stop hiring old futs. Old futs cost more than young coaches. An old fut at $500k is expensive. Hire a young coach at $200k, take the $300k savings, and fund 30 more student-athlete scholarships, in any and all sports.
2. Reduce salaries by 20 percent for all top UH administrators, including CC administrators, as these guys are all overpaid for what they do. Take the savings, put that money into improving pay the the instructors and assistant coaches or other lesser trainers and support staff. Take some of this money and balance the budget for the other athletic programs.
3. Do not under any circumstance increase fees or tuition. UH is a public university. It should be affordable, to the locals, for all generations. Attending athletic events should never be mandatory. Holding someone’s money hostage unless they attend is a poor approach to building loyalty or support the the program.
Rodney #30 I agree. Unless we absolutely have to have the money.
Our record shows that we are a bottom rung Div 1 football team and have been for a few years. So what? If we are looking to do the most with what we have why schedule the schools that are far above us in ability and budgets.. Schedule the teams that are within our ability to honestly compete with. Hopefully a winning record will gain enthusiasm and more fans. I enjoyed the SJSU and the UNLV games. Teams doing their best to win against challenging foes of the same caliber made for entertaining games. Give us more. Who wants to see our boys play against the mighty teams with a predictable outcome of a lopsided loss? Not me. We are who we are. No shame! We have our pluses and minuses.
73… Not supporting the programs gives UH the justification to shut down the athletic department. You’d be probably do some of the BOR a favor by not supporting. It feels like there is a faction within the BOR that wants Athletics gone.
The unintended consequences can sometimes be the most costly.
Mack was fired because for $1 mill, we expect to win.
Seems for $500k, we are ok with losing.
Did that meeting after the season between BJ and NC take place yet? We need a HC change because perennial losing is unacceptable to Hawaii fans.
GOOD AFTERNOON, HAWAII!
UNLV new head football coach – Bishop Gorman’s Head Coach Tony Sanchez
Oh, subject to approval by the regents
can’t say they don’t move faster than UH…….
#64. That is until BJ makes a UAB announcement for UH, right?
only 2 days to go… wonder when bj will meet with nc.. n announce ‘HIS’ decision….
can’t wait…getting nervous…
#81. An attempt to keep the LV players from the local powerhouse home to play for the home team? Sounds familiar.
KLAS breaking news link:
http://www.8newsnow.com/story/27542597/sources-tony-sanchez-to-be-named-next-unlv-coach
… way off topic …
hope this bodes well for us consumers …
NextEra Energy to buy Hawaiian Electric for $4.3B
http://www.staradvertiser.com/news/breaking/20141203_Nextera_Energy_to_buy_Hawaiian_Electric_for_43_billion.html?id=284664501
NO NO NO! Doubling the student athletics fee is a terrible idea, and charging community college students any fee at all is an atrocious idea, especially if you’re including the neighbor island CCs – what likelihood is there that students from Kauai Community College will be able to attend Manoa events? And even if they could, why would/should they? Manoa is separate from the CCs although they are all part of the same System. CC students should NOT have to pay for Manoa activities, and Manoa students should not have to bear the burden of the Athletics department’s poor decision making that is leading them further and further into deficit. I am outraged at the very idea.
… odda kine stuff …
SMU: Per sources, Chad Morris has released everyone from June’s staff with the exception of DFO Randy Ross and Director of High School Relations Tam Hollingshead.
Looks like the video coordinator will be looking for a job – if he needs one.
20. Warrior Fan, won 8 games, not 9 games, only one less though or 2.67 per year average. Unless you’re counting a scrimmage game or something.
3prong and D1shima–the cats next opponent and victory, see: http://www.widenerpride.com/roster.aspx?path=football
88. ai ; Dan Morrison, Wes Suan and Mel deLaura had been with Jones for a long time.
57
Pretty clear Jim Donovan was out of the loop along with Mack month before the things hit the fan. It appeared to me there was a power play by a power click to gain control of the athletic department. Deduced this from Jim Donovan’s testimony that Mack was a victim of a number of charges based on who knows what. Curious that one of the coaches who was pressuring other UH coaches to sign a petition backing Rockne Freitas to be AD was Norm Chow. Quid Pro Quo?
Well, maybe now Gorman might stop “recruiting” local players before UH even knows what’s going on!
Ackchally, Sanchez may now be in position to go directly at Hawaii recruits, albeit without the Fetitta $ backing him.
I thought Hawaii was getting paid to travel to Ohio and Wisconsin… If so why would they cancel a guaranteed pay day that would go to help cushion the blow of the travel subsidies we pay to teams…
94. Islandman… Thanks for the clarification. Even more reason for a coaching change. Go warriors!
me tinks again that the LTG was the better UH President choice for leadership purposes – perhaps the power brokers were afraid of what he would do to their “friends”
All UH supporters including UH BOR and Administration should lobby the Legislature for a $7,000,000 annual allotment as a DIRECT allocation to UHAD based on upholding Patsy Mink’s legacy of co-sponsoring Title IX ( equal gender sports rights ) – this can only be spent on supporting all the NON-REVENUE sports and with that all the “women’s” teams at UH-Manoa and cover all “travel subsidies” for MWC football teams – guess when UH agreed to this stipulation for UH to join the MWC all the ADs must have been laughing their arses off cause they now get free travel to Hawaii!!!!!!!!!
Isn’t Fei Jai an old fart?
Don’t self-loathe, old man.
who is LTG? Please take the time to write the name instead of abbreviations lol.
Caller to 1420 today asked when info about MBB violations would be released. Gary D said maybe never if UH decides not to release them. No mention of NCAA sanctions either. Lost two coaches and Fotu right before the season over hopefully something significant.
We have a lot of smart, highly paid, administrators at UH. It would be good if some of them could think on this a bit. http://www.uhpa.org/salary-research/executive-management-salaries/
I’m fairly certain GD is not in the loop on the investigation.
95 boo and d1: If can,…Can. No, can,…STILL CAN. Can beat #10 if we beat #2!
Thanks for the link. GO ‘CATS!
Sooooooooo, is anyone working to get the game on tv? ..or is there a feed?
UH season tickets are really cheap. 2010 data shows UH cheap seats at $89 for the season versus $201 for Boise State. UH cheap seats are now $99, so still a bargain. Adding an average of $100 ticket to 20,000 tickets brings in $2M/year more. Add 5,000 tickets at $200 each brings in another $1M/year. This seems reasonable for a winning UH team that could compete with Boise State, Utah State, Colorado State, etc. An investment is needed first to get the program back on track, but then UH season ticket holders will need to pay a more reasonable price for good entertainment.
https://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1094191
Duke Game that is.
one season: i’m with you. Hate to pay more but quality costs $. No free meals ( unless you like eat da next day) hehe.
Comment #106 referred to getting UH administrators thinking about addressing UH Athletics budget, not any pending NCAA violations.
After cutting the coaches and losing the best player, admin better not hold out on any NCAA results. If they do the public will demand that heads roll from administration.
….ok das all.
3-Prong: 7 games for $99 is an unbelievable deal for exciting games. That works out to $14 a game, compared to $8 to $9 for one beer at the game. If the stadium authority would dump their bento sniffing dogs at the gate, folks could save a bit on food too 🙂
Too many locals moved to LV. Now UNLV has Hawaii mentality.
Ben Jay has raised no money for UH sports. He is a waste of space.
oneseason: You sit in the Makai North end zone too? I like your idea about Deleting the bag check line…..Brilliant. Folks will feel more welcome eating their own favorites. After that we will work on allowing rolling coolers! hehe
So BJ and Chow were supposed to meet on Tuesday to discuss the future of the program. Well, its Wednesday and Chow is still the coach. I guess I better just deal with it at this point.
I’m not in favor of dumping games against quality opponents at all. Anywhere, any place. That is my preference. I’d rather watch UH play against an Ohio State, Wisconsin, etc. over watching them play Rice, UNLV, Northern whoever any day.
#121. Kev-1: Even if they lose all those games? You would rather watch them lose against Ohio State, Wisconsin, Wash. State, Oregon State, Michigan than win against Rice, UNLV, No. ___ ?
AdmrVT … YES! Because they don’t play a full schedule of top tiered teams anyway. I’ll take a couple of those losses any day. Games are more fun to watch when there is that underdog hope for the home team.
And there is no guarantee that UH will win against the Rice, UNLV, Northern whoevers anyway. I’d be more satisfied watching them lose to a team they are supposed to lose to (yet hope for the best) than I would watching them lose to a team that they are supposed to beat, which has become the trend.
I still believe playing better competition makes a team better.
RE: #119
3-Prong — now you have me dreaming. Since no one in authority will seriously read this, I’ll throw out my ideas for getting fans back to Aloha Stadium…
1. ALL games start at 7:30 pm or later. Tailgaters can have dinner at a more normal time.
2. The wide aisle in the upper Halawa lot leading to the ticket office/South end zone should be lined with food vendors…think: “Eat the Street”.
3. The food vendors can reserve a stall for $50. Parking in the Halawa lots should be raised to $10 (from $5) and the extra $5 given to UH. The stadium can keep the $50 vendor charge.
4. The Na Koa tailgate should be in the portion of the upper Halawa lot where the season ticket holders purchase their parking pass at $150+ per season– which the guys next to them pay $5 . Throw in a few extras and amenities for them.
5. Let people bring food (a plate lunch size container) and drinks (6-pack max) into the stadium. Allow small folding umbrellas for sun and rain… no need worry about sun if games start at 7:00 pm.
6. If the game time is 7:30 pm, open the parking lots up at 3:00 pm and allow tailgaters to stay until midnight. If the gates open at 3:00 pm, it is possible to still hold half-day swap meets (for stadium revenue).
7. Lower individual ticket prices at the stadium 50% on game day and let Oceanic raise the price of PPV if UH gets more.
Any other ideas?
The Washington and OSU games this year were among the more entertaining games to watch of the season. Both losses, both fun to watch. The wins this year were probably among the least exciting games to watch in terms of performance. With the exception of the UNLV game, of course.
#119: 3-Prong … yes. Good cheap seats. Maybe add a “corkage fee” so Aloha Stadium gets a fair cut. 🙂
Solution.
Go to the top man. Sell him on the idea of the residual effect of UH sports to the state of Hawaii, school and community. Use key words like spawn. Draw a picture. And emphasis the derivative of such-visibility to the school, taxable income, tax revenue, jobs, benefit to the HVB, recreational value to onlookers (fans), blossoming value to young children looking on, and the multiplying effect of former UH athletes (both locally and from out of state) that make Hawaii their home (and even their offspring’s home someday) after their playing days are over.
If the governor is smart, or legislature, this picture is all the persuasion that is needed.
3 million annual loses that the UHAD is stewing over with doomsday theories need the top man (and others) to see that this doesn’t happen. The rewards outweigh the loses-easily.
The powers to be-governor, legislature, board of regents need to work with keeping UHAD afloat. Subsidize even more, cut some slack, ask for some help from the league and NCAA (it doesn’t hurt trying), create a 3$ check off box on state tax returns benefiting UHAD and/or appeal to the community for their help and support, too.
UH is proud school. The alumnus are proud. If the day came that -push came to shove -I hope push wins.
In the interim the only thing I question is how can the last 2 UHAD AD’s be released, yet the staff working under these AD’s remain intact. Or how is it the names on failing coaches/AD selection committees be the same on reoccurring ones?
The way I look at it give UHAD a lot of scrutiny and latitude, hope for the best, but it’s really the big picture (see paragraph 1) that should be the focus.
I found the Northern Iowa (NIU) and Nevada home games to be the most enlightening. The NIU game was close, and we got a chance to see some really good clock management/offensive strategy by the NIU coaching staff … which hopefully our side learned from. The contrast between the first and second halves of the Nevada game was significant and interesting. In the first half, Hawaii maintained a small lead against a vanilla Nevada offensive strategy. In the second half, Nevada coaching changed strategy and dominated on offense. That indicated that we had similar player ability as Nevada, but were being outcoached (by Rolo). The Washington game gave me false hope for the season. It was Petersen’s first game with the Huskies, with his 2nd string QB. After watching the Apple cup victory over WSU, I think we would have been destroyed by the Huskies late in the season. The Utah State game was a huge disappointment; seeing a true freshman QB in his first starting game take apart UH was not pleasant.
For the 2015 season, we play Ohio State and Wisconsin on the road. In 2010, those two teams (respectively) had the #1 and #3 highest “Cheap seats” season ticket costs at $2,107 & $1,294, compared to Hawaii’s $89. That is an amazing contrast.
https://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1094191
Some good ideas. Again someone with a vision to move aggressively forward needs to be at the helm….some toes will get damaged, but what is important, a foundation for sustained growth over time. If all or most were implemented…..fees, equitable deal for stadium, monies siphoned off (like bookstore revenue of athletic gear) and a coalition of state, university, and donor base…..this would be accomplished. I certainly hope we go on offense because the current posture is nothing short of absurd.
Good morning, Tsai-kos!
Many interesting suggestions!
SteveM: You’ve got some pretty creative ideas there. Hey Stadium Authority, you paying attention?
Great Morning All!
3-Prong/Boo,
Early kickoff on Saturday…7am HT. Here da link.
https://new.livestream.com/accounts/9863050
Looks like get one fee. 👿
GO ‘CATS!
Taking the allowable fuud idea further…
Allow small (12 can size…get it?) coolers in that UH sells in advance. Only those specific coolers will be allowed. As a fundraiser maybe a cooler sells for $100, UH advances a portion of the sale to the Stadium Authority ala the “corkage fee” and banks the rest!
“UH football makes money”. Depends on how you do the accounting. If you take everything into account, including capital costs for the stadium etc., it does not make money. Very few college football programs do.
The sports teams are a kind of parasite on the academics. Without the academics, there is no university, without the sports, the university is still there. By this logic, the UH sports teams should be paying the university some kind of royalty, not the other way around. Ok, this is stretching the point a little thin. But, as for school spirit, and so on, this may be better accomplished with intra-murals. One suggestion is to require/expect that all students play some sport. Some would argue this is a better use of the money, and more in keeping with the UH educational mission.
#135 … that is a really good idea!
d1: Genius with Da Grren Coolah idea! I Get It!
#104:
LTG refers to the General Officer final candidate with Lassner.
If the LTG was worth any “salt” he would be well versed in the decision making process and delegation of authority, but always retains the “responsibility” for whatever happens on his watch.
Mahalo nui D1shima!!
Nebraska hired Oregon State’s Mike Riley as its new football coach on Thursday, replacing the fired Bo Pelini.
per AP
CSU lost its head coach to Florida, but will get something like $7.8 Million from Florida to buy him out of his contract.
But really wanted to say that Tsai’s idea of cutting Football scholarships is a good one and is being proposed as a way for the non-power conferences to stay around. It cuts costs and lets current budgets go further. But it also allows the cutting of women’s scholarships under Title IX by however many men’s scholarships are cut.
Ding, ding, ding: http://hawaiiwarriorworld.com/?p=26438