The morning after RPI: UH 4, UCI 6
Apologies. Been traveling all day
And in the middle of a couple of VB-related stories
latest RPI finally released.
No surprise. UH 4, UCI 6
https://www.ncaa.com/rankings/volleyball-men/nc/nc-mens-volleyball-rpi
Strength of schedule: UH 1, UCI 10
Doesn’t sound like there is any recourse.
Have not heard from Matlin if he is filing a complaint
Oh, not that the poll matters but the coaches voted UH 4, UCI 5
https://www.avca.org/polls/dii-men/4-23-2018.html
COMMENTS
Comments are closed.
On previous tread someone question why UH is hosting the Big West tournament.
That is not an NCAA decision. The Big West is rotating the tournament. Long Beach got it this year, Hawaii next year, UCI in 2020. Not sure where it goes after that.
Wow Cindy, I can’t believe in the 3 things u pointed out UH was ahead of UCI in all three. I also read somewhere that it’s SUPPOSED to be where if u are on the committee and ur team or any team ur associated with is in consideration, your supposed to excuse yourself to make sure no conflict of interests arise. Is that true? Did that happen this time around? Does anyone monitor the selection committee ?
Not surprising at all. The RPI is used as justification for icing out a school where it works, but where it does not work, they fabricate reasons for their “difficult” decision. Kind of tough to explain away the head-to-head results and the recent win over previously unbeaten LBSU.
The Committee:
Janine Oman, Ohio State Asst AD (Exp Aug 2018)
Ashley Armstrong, UCLA Assoc AD (Exp Aug 2021)
Leonard Kaplan, New Jersey IT, AD (Exp Aug 2020)
http://web1.ncaa.org/committees/committees_roster.jsp?CommitteeName=MVB
Several more years of Armstrong, who is a UCLA admin who went to and played UC Davis. It should not be a surprise that she gave the nod to the UC system sister school down the I-405, UCI. The new Judith Holland for UH?
Oman’s background is as an athletic trainer. Is she a volleyball person in any sense? Armstrong played volleyball at UC Davis, but we know where she has her loyalties.
I agree with your earlier sentiments Cindy. I’m a diehard UH fan win/lose. We haven’t been completely hosed by the NCAA in a while so I guess it was only inevitable whether Warriors/Wahine. Latest RPI/AVCA Poll is a slap in the face to UH & their fans and a big middle finger to the NCAA & their 3-person, if you can even call it a committee, committee. NCAA should hire/consult gurus of the game like Shoji, Haley, Pettit, Heber (when healthy), Dunning, Dunphy, Scates, etc. I know that’s farfecthed, but better than any of the past incompetent people at the helm.
Getting back to our Warriors. The shoulda coulda wouldas about that 5-set loss to the Beach on Night 1. Would a win have tipped the scale in our favor? Who knows. Sad to see the career of a kid like Tui get cut short. I wouldn’t be surprised to see another career as a Warrior come to an end well before its time. Hard to keep every pin happy.
If an AD wants the support of fans, and the draw of participation in the NCAA tournament for prospective player recruitments, then he or she should request that the NCAA review their tournament selection “methods” for very bad situations such as this. It makes sense to take time before publically responding, I think. Hopefully AD Matlin is gathering information and preparing a review request.
http://www.offtheblockblog.com/2018/04/hawaii-tops-strength-of-schedule-rankings-used-for-selection-sunday/
On the other hand, LBSU was No. 15 in SOS.
Strength of schedule has UH No. 1 now. A serious WTF! Down with the NCAA committee! Seriously DOWN! There should have been another play in match between UH and UCI, but actually UH should have gotten the final at-large.
Is Matlin our AD? He or someone on the higher UH athletic management should definitely file a complaint.
Without the head to head at the Big West tourney I could see justification for Irvine getting in… But everyone who knows anything about volleyball saw that match as a win and you’re in match, this is an outrage and I will be sending the committee an email… Hopefully the AD will speak up!!! Have we heard from Coach Wade ?
I believe that the current time is a make or break for AD Matlin. The outcome may be final, but the opportunity to speak truth to power still remains. None of the information since released justifies the selection of UC Irvine, including the RPI and SOS employed by the committee. As such, we remain baffled as we were before.
Although there are much worse disappointments to be had in life, such does not justify a lack of an official complaint to the NCAA or demand for accountability. The relative silence from AD Matlin thus far has been deafening, amplified by his somewhat rather soft comments in the story published today. He has always seemed to be conscientious and thoughtful, and I hope that he will lead by example to seek transparency, to advocate on behalf of us all, to put the NCAA on notice, and to respectfully protest and communicate that corruption and misconduct require recourse. The outcome may remain, but I hope that AD Matlin will uphold truth, integrity, and justice as the standards to which we should strive rather than silent acceptance.
I don’t know of any other sport where the 4th ranked team not get into the NCAA tournament. Why couldn’t the NCAA selection committee wait until after the RPI rankings and Strength of Schedule are released before making their selections.
Volleyball does not get enough national attention to make the UH Volleyball snub a controversial national story. Can Cindy Luis or our friends, the Sports Animals, call ESPN’s Neil Everett to bring it to his attention? He can then make it a story to bring more exposure at the national level.
Cindy, thanks for the RPI and SOS numbers. Those make it hard to make our case. However, if the Committee wanted to, there is no requirement (as I understand it) for them to use RPI and SOS. As an example– assume we were higher than UCI on SOS and RPI– but we tied on head to head but lost the last two games– the committee could use the final two games to pick UCI. I think what is so painful for us is that the Committee did not pick us because of the run we made in the last part of the season. I would guess that SOS and our losses in the first half or more of the season is what hurt us on numbers.
Too early in the morning. Got my post mixed up. Ignore and I will rewrite after a few hours of sleep and coffee.
The information at the link below is interesting and, if the selection committee assessed the information in the same way as portrayed in this analysis, reveals the fundamental flaw in the selection process:
http://www.offtheblockblog.com/2018/04/bracketology-every-selection-sunday-datapoint-comparing-hawaii-uc-irvine/
The flaw is that there are 10 selection criteria made up of 67 separate selection components and in this analysis all of them are weighted equally!
IMHO that’s insane. Nobody creating a sensible approach to comparing the merits and strengths of two teams would devise so many obscure selection components (“Non-conference home record vs. teams No. 11-15 in RPI”) and weight each one the same as the fundamentally important considerations of head-to-head competition, overall RPI ranking and overall strength of schedule.
Even if the committee in its deliberations didn’t actually weight all of the components equally, just the presence of so many obscure and meaningless points of comparison creates enough “noise” in the process to skew the results. It also opens the door to the committee members manipulating the results in any way they like. Give me that many levers to pull and I can devise a weighting scheme that favors whichever team you choose.
A rational process would start with a few key criteria and deem that a team that is superior according to those criteria is the selection. If the teams are equal based on those criteria, you move on to a primary tiebreaker, and then if necessary on to a secondary tiebreaker. That’s how conference championships and auto bids are awarded. To instead hand the selection committee this 67-headed monster and then say “interpret it as you like” as the basis for awarding at-large bids is indefensible.
Appeal by Matlin will do nothing….its not like the committee will go back and change their mind. However, what I would like to see (not sure if it has come out) is an explanation from the committee on their “reasoning” for selecting UCI over Hawaii.
We all see the numbers, and hear about the criteria…..but obviously, the committee did not go “by the book” when selecting this at-large bid.
I’m just curious as to what they were thinking and their rationale between choosing UCI over Hawaii, because it definitely wasnt RPI, strength of schedule, head-to-head, etc.
https://twitter.com/UHBeachVolley/status/988871656121626624
Brackets are out for the Big West Tournament this weekend! Hawaii is the top seed and faces the winner of CSUN and CSU Bakersfield.
So excited that the Big West is putting in a pairs tournament, I really miss pairs getting to face unfamiliar pairs. Hawaii gets their top four pairs in of 16 teams. I can see an all Hawaii semifinals if our #3 and #4 duos are on fire.
#16, is there another way to see this than Twitter? I keep getting a “rate limited” message. Thanks.
I-405 Highway Robbery
#13, Spot on.
Over on VT, using the men’s selection committee processes as precedent applied to the beach criteria, I’ve provided a beach committee rationale for excluding USC from at-large selection in the NCAA Beach tournament, and giving the at-large to Cal Poly and FIU. Tongue-in-cheek, yes. But within the realm of stupefying possibility, yes. I won’t link to it here; you can look for my recent posts on VT if you want to read it.
16. I admire your positivity, but I am not sure that it will be an all UH semi-final in the pairs competition. Kan/Weaver vs. Martin/Monkhouse will happen before that. Also, Homuyun and Ozee over Barber/Karelov may also be a tall order.
Who put this bracket together (and seeded the teams)? While flattering, I find it weird that Martin/Monkhouse would get the #3 seed over LBSU’s and CSUN’s #1 pairs? Kan/Weaver are seeded #6 over CSUN’s #1 pair and LBSU’s #2 pair). While this sounds good at first, it actually makes a more difficult bracket for our #1 pair (Maglio/Schucht) and pits our #2 and #3 pair together sooner.
The bracket that Maglio/Schucht are in, face two #1 pairs LBSU Barber/Karelov, Owens/Sato (I can’t see Owens and Sato as a #8 seed as they have a good record against some top-ranked #1 pairs and even in losing played many good teams to 3 sets). Then they put arguably the second best #2 pair (Sonny/Manley – CP) in the same bracket.
T.Van Winden and Miric face two #2 pairs (Kruidof/Nieto LBSU and Martin/Monkhouse).
Whoever wins between Kan/Weaver and Martin/Monkhouse (I will assume Martin/Monkhouse) have an easier route to the semi’s than Maglio and Schucht in my opinion. I would actually say it is easier than T. Van Winden/Miric’s route to the semi’s as well who have to face Kruidof/Nieto or Harward/Adamcikova.
Based on seeds (predictions) the semi’s will have Maglio/Schucht will face Barber/Karelov (if they can get past Owens/Sato), and Martin/Monkhouse will likely face T.Van Winden/Miric.
Hopefully, our #4 pair Homuyun/Ozee can surprise and do well against CP #2 pair and LBSU’s #1 pair to make it at least 3 teams in the semi-finals!
i am willing to bet my house and my entire life savings that if Irvine had the #1 SOS, the #4 RPI and beat Hawaii 2 of the 3 times they met, the committee will gladly emphasize those criteria and use it to justify putting in Irvine over UH.
The NCAA committee have always tried to find reason to not include UH and all that crap about road wins and stuff is just a reason to keep us out.
Really love the support from other athletes to The warrior players on social media especially from Torrey Van Winden.
The lesson that Dave Shoji learned way back applies now with Charlie Wade…Just win the league and don’t leave it in the committee’s hands. In other words, don’t give a reason NOT to take us.
#23 That’s not a ‘lesson’, it’s the status quo. Basically, it’s a call for inaction. Win the championship has been, will forever be, every teams goal.
@WarriorFan, possible to copy and paste or maybe repeat what other athletes are saying to encourage UH?
17. Greenthumb, the bracket is also posted on the Bigwest.org site under women’s beach volleyball home page – small
Print Championship info.,
Pairs bracket etc. Sorry I don’t have the link at the moment. I will post later if I get a chance.
http://hawaiiathletics.com/news/2018/4/20/womens-beach-volleyball-sandbows-host-2018-big-west-tournament.aspx
This link has bracket info. Etc for Sandbows.
new thread up for Thursday.
http://www.hawaiiwarriorworld.com/?p=45802